2010 Spring Mini Con

[Stephen]

Here is the official 2010 Spring Mini Con thread to post all the dates, games, rules, etc.

I believe it is being held in late April in Madison, WI. I've not been able to attend in recent years but I have high hopes.

[albpilot]

Feb 28, 2010 22:53:33 GMT -5 Stephen said:

Here is the official 2010 Spring Mini Con thread to post all the dates, games, rules, etc.

I believe it is being held in late April in Madison, WI. I've not been able to attend in recent years but I have high hopes.

Cool, at least someone from here will get to go.

[noski]

It is the weekend of April 16th. I thought a flyer would have been sent out by now.

[Stephen]

We have no flyer and discontent here in Indy is again reaching critical mass.

The Spring Mini Con - back in the Kankakee days - was held in mid-March. We wanted a spring event for Indy but we didn't want to conflict with anything the society was doing, so we deliberately created Red Baron Fight.

The Red Baron died on April 21st. It was the perfect calendar date, the perfect match up of cool airplanes, and the perfect historical event to use as a basis. And we could run it every year and never worry about conflicting with the Spring Mini Con.

So then the Spring Mini Con starts moving into April and running over us every year. We petition the powers that be to have it moved back where it belongs. They agree. Now, a few years later, its happening again. They've scheduled directly over Red Baron Fight yet again.

We love the Con and want to support the society, but we cannot do that when the society demands to hold its events on conflicting dates.

At our last gaming day, it was suggested (not by me) that we move RBF back to its regular date (Apr 17) and play it. The suggestion was enthusiastically received.

So next time you hear someone whine about no Indy players at the Con, remember that there is a very legitimate concern here and despite my encouragement and attempts to support the society, the Con is seen here as a direct aggressor against our event.

I'm doing the best I can, but if the Con wants any of our players there, they might consider throwing me a frickin' bone.

[bergovoy]

As I clearly mentioned in an e-mail to you directly, there was a legitimate reason this year to have in in April, since the hotels in Milwaukee were booked and recovering from NCAA games here on our normal weekend, now I realize our players may not have attended the NCAA tourney but the hotels were certainly full.

We then had Easter, and it has proven detrimental to attendance to have an event either on Easter weekend or the weekend directly after. Over the past four years, we have had it on the last weekend of March, which barring special circumstances will be it's normal weekend.

While on the subject of attendance at official society events, the FITS Society made certain that events were run at a LOCAL FREE convention in Indianapolis and only !1 LOCAL player showed up, and he is the one who volunteered to run the event. I have heard the comments that Gen Con is always too expensive to attend, and I understand that for many that is the case, but the cost at Whosyercon was FREE and it was in the squadrons own city. It would have been a great way to recruit new players to the fold, as there were over 500 attendees to the convention.

There was a poll taken several years ago as to when the members or the FITS society wanted the convention and the majority wanted the end of March/early April, so we chose the last weekend of March

[jenhenducky]

Stephen, you say, "So then the Spring Mini Con starts moving into April and running over us every year. We petition the powers that be to have it moved back where it belongs. They agree. Now, a few years later, its happening again. They've scheduled directly over Red Baron Fight yet again."

The Spring Mini Con while it was in Kankakee was held on these dates with the Red Baron Fight dates in ():
Mar 16-17, 1991 (April 20)
date unknown for 1992 but it didn't appear to have interfered (April 18)
Mar 26-28, 1993 (April 17)
Mar 18-20, 1994 (November)
Mar 31 - Apr 2, 1995 (May 27)
date unknown for 1996 and may have interfered with RBF (June 29)
Apr 11-13, 1997 (Mar 22)
Apr 10-12 1998 (April 25)
Apr 30 - May 2, 1999 (April 23)
Mar 30 - Apr 1, 2001 (no date found, but Spring Mini Con not near April 21st)
Apr 17-19, 2002 with your approval (May 11)
Apr 11-13, 2003 (April 19)

When George and I took over this event in 2004 you did mention that in the past there had been conflict with the Red Baron Fight and you would like us to avoid the weekend around April 21. I then did a short survey asking when players would like to have it and the last weekend of March won. As you can see by the date history I've provided we have consistently avoided the weekend you were concerned with.

Since George and I took over scheduling, these have been the Spring Mini Con dates, with RBF dates in ():
held in Kankakee on May 15-17, 2004 (April 17)
held in Kankakee on Apr 29 - May 1, 2005 (April 9)
held @ Holiday Inn Express in Milwaukee on Mar 31 - Apr 2, 2006 (April 29)
held @ Holiday Inn Express in Milwaukee on Mar 30 - Apr 1, 2007 (April 21)
held @ Holiday Inn Express in Milwaukee on Mar 28 - Mar 30, 2008 (May 10)
held @ Holiday Inn Express in Milwaukee on Mar 27 - Mar 29, 2009 (May 2)
held @ Holiday Inn Express in Milwaukee on Apr 16 - Apr 18, 2010

History shows that the Spring Mini Con has very VERY rarely interfered with the RBF.

Not only did you give your approval in 2002, but you did so again this year. In an email George sent you on NOVEMBER 13, 2009 he asked for your input regarding the date dilemma. Due to the NCAA Tourney being in town the weekend we'd normally hold the Spring Mini Con there was a good possibility it'd be moved to what may be the RBF weekend. Your reply, also on NOVEMBER 13, 2009, "april 17 was our RBF date and we can't do april 24, but i think we can move to may 1st. any later than that and it pretty much kills both our local monthly schedule and the idea behind RBF.

"so those are my suggestions - the best idea, even without RBF, is march 26. next best is april 16 and we move RBF to may 1. we can go along with either."

Sounds to me like we AGAIN did what you asked. Since the hotel didn't allow us to book on the March 26th weekend we took the April 16th weekend.

On another note, we've never held it in late April OR in Madison, WI. Next time you might want to get your facts straight before you post.

You say, "I'm doing the best I can, but if the Con wants any of our players there, they might consider throwing me a frickin' bone."

Maybe we should just move the Spring Mini Con to Indy and wait to see what excuses you and your players come up with then! Then again, Who's Yer Con was in Indy and held Dawn Partrol events on Friday night and Saturday afternoon and you STILL didn't show up... AND IT WAS FREE!!!

[Stephen]

Thank you for your comments. We agree entirely.

RBF was created as an April event in order to avoid the March mini-con. It worked well until around 1997, when the con began moving into April and creating conflicts, as I mentioned earlier. This continued until around 2003, as your date list demonstrates.

Then in 2004 the con was placed back on its original March schedule, as previously mentioned. And, as pointed out, it is again scheduled for April this year.

Thank you again for posting the date list. You are correct in every instance.

[KevinR]

Apr 11, 2010 13:15:27 GMT -5 Stephen said:

Thank you for your comments. We agree entirely.

RBF was created as an April event in order to avoid the March mini-con. It worked well until around 1997, when the con began moving into April and creating conflicts, as I mentioned earlier. This continued until around 2003, as your date list demonstrates.

Then in 2004 the con was placed back on its original March schedule, as previously mentioned. And, as pointed out, it is again scheduled for April this year.

Thank you again for posting the date list. You are correct in every instance.

Which establishes once again Stephen's point that the Society has repeatedly over the years scheduled over Indy's event which we've always traditionally tried to hold as close as possible to the correlating date in history in regards to the Red Baron. I know for a fact over the years I've seen and heard him on dozens of occasions doing everything he could to try to encourage us Indy players to come to Society events.

Alienating a guy who does that isn't very wise in my opinion. Dozens of us in Indy would have never heard of Dawn Patrol if it were not for Stephen Skinner being the kind of friend and DP player that he is. I encourage the Society not to forget this fact.

[KevinR]

Apr 10, 2010 13:26:32 GMT -5 jenhenducky said:

Maybe we should just move the Spring Mini Con to Indy and wait to see what excuses you and your players come up with then! Then again, Who's Yer Con was in Indy and held Dawn Partrol events on Friday night and Saturday afternoon and you STILL didn't show up... AND IT WAS FREE!!!

Your dates and information may be right, but the spirit with which it was offered is not.

Nobody made excuses to not show up. If an event was held here and we could make it we came. Quite frankly these types of attitudes won't do anything to encourage Indy players that I know to come to your events. You catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar.

The WhosyerCon (sp?) was also scheduled on the same date as local Indy Squadron gaming (a fact conveniently ignored), dates which had been scheduled months and months ahead of time. In fact in our own Indy Squadron local gaming section of the forum we were discussing playing that very day and everyone of us had forgotten completely about the WhosyerCon.

Nobody had posted it on our calender as a reminder even though every person who is a member of this forum has access to said calender, and that would help a lot to let us in Indy know something is coming up.

On the morning that the event was held there were approximately 6-9 Indy Squadron players ready to play Dawn Patrol on our normally scheduled gaming day, and Stephen Skinner cancelled the normally scheduled gaming day to accomidate the WhosyerCon for whomever wanted to attend that event. There were several of us who said let's get together and play anyway, and nobody felt like making the extra long trip out to where the event was being held, so we just scratched it.

So again I say to you that Stephen is not your problem as it relates to Indy players not being interested in Society events. But attitudes like those in the post above are.

[KevinR]

I just checked and the WhosyerCon is listed on the calender for March but I sure don't remember seeing it on there, especially not in the weeks leading up to that date.

[KevinR]

Speaking of Society events, every other year the winner of the Indy Squadron title was promised a spot in the Master's tournament. I am the winner from this past year, and I've received no info about the event. Is there anyone that can tell me about it? All I know for sure is I was told by Stephen that it was going to be held at Gen Con this year. Is that correct?

[albpilot]

[quote author=pastorkevin board=events thread=568 post=6082 time=1271109451


Nobody made excuses to not show up. If an event was held here and we could make it we came.

The WhosyerCon (sp?) was also scheduled on the same date as local Indy Squadron gaming (a fact conveniently ignored), dates which had been scheduled months and months ahead of time. In fact in our own Indy Squadron local gaming section of the forum we were discussing playing that very day and everyone of us had forgotten completely about the WhosyerCon.

Nobody had posted it on our calender as a reminder even though every person who is a member of this forum has access to said calender, and that would help a lot to let us in Indy know something is coming up.

On the morning that the event was held there were approximately 6-9 Indy Squadron players ready to play Dawn Patrol on our normally scheduled gaming day, and Stephen Skinner cancelled the normally scheduled gaming day to accomidate the WhosyerCon for whomever wanted to attend that event. There were several of us who said let's get together and play anyway, and nobody felt like making the extra long trip out to where the event was being held, so we just scratched it.


[/quote]

To clarify. The March gaming date was deliberately scheduled on the caledar AT WhosyerCon for March when I originally discussed it with Stephen. Where that changed, or was not communicated, or not posted, I don't know. However, I seem to recall I posted at least one comment on this board to that effect early on, and the communication on this board in the week prior to the event was clearly indicative that the game was supposed to be at WhosyerCon.

However, I would like to point out that there is historical evidence that when an event is held (either here or in WI) that attendance from Indy players is woefully slim. As an example, I offer GenCon. Here in Indy for years and the only players to regularly attend are me, Stephen, SD, and Graham - lately just me and Stephen. So the perception we do not attend is a valid one and cannot be disputed.

And from my point of view, if there are 6-9 players waiting to play on the same day a game is scheduled (but not at a normal venue), then the fact that they chose not to haul their carcasses off their couches and drive 20 minutes (which is the same amount of time I have to drive to Stephen's house to game there) is EXACTLY the point Jen is making with her comment. And to further illustrate, Ken spent the better part of 2 years driving 5 hours EACH WAY to play for one day, yet we can't be counted on to drive 20 minutes when we were already going to play in the first place just because it's inconvenient for us? Seem a bit hypocritical to anyone?

Forgive the forceful reply, but I felt strongly there is as much truth on the side of the Society as their is on the IndySquadron.

[Stephen]

It is true that Indy has had poor attendance at outside events over the last ten years or so. You're welcome to debate why and I'll concede any conclusion you reach.

But the primary point remains, and Jen's date list illustrates it perfectly: the society mini-con started in March and then began intruding into April and overrunning RBF. Then it stopped for several years. Now it's started again. That is a fact. You can debate why and how til doomsday, but the facts are indisputable.

It's probably better for us to hold RBF on it's normal date, and for the con to schedule without regard to RBF. If the con runs over RBF, so be it. Debate over.

[Michael]

RBF is on May 1st. Correct?

[albpilot]

Apr 12, 2010 17:01:46 GMT -5 KevinR said:

Speaking of Society events, every other year the winner of the Indy Squadron title was promised a spot in the Master's tournament. I am the winner from this past year, and I've received no info about the event. Is there anyone that can tell me about it? All I know for sure is I was told by Stephen that it was going to be held at Gen Con this year. Is that correct?

The Masters is Sunday at the MiniCon this year Kevin.