KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 17:42:43 GMT -5
Stephen,
If Switzerland is so great why would they demand that you be apart from your family for 5 years or pay a ridiculous sum of money to move there?
And yes you did plainly state you didn't think the US government would let you leave.
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:05:42 GMT -5
Stephen, If Switzerland is so great why would they demand that you be apart from your family for 5 years or pay a ridiculous sum of money to move there? I merely said I would move there if I could in answer to someone's question. If I were to list the benefits of Switzerland here, you would refuse to believe it or ignore it entirely. I answered the question. You may accept it or reject it as you please. Please cut and paste the exact quote here in which I stated that the US government would not allow me to leave so I can correct myself and apologize for being mistaken. |
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:16:24 GMT -5
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:17:33 GMT -5
And then you proceeded to claim that US citizens are not permitted to leave the country or some other such drivel that comes from the kinds of sources you get your "Amerikan Police State" info from.
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:27:10 GMT -5
I stand by that statement. If the US government would permit my family to leave, and if it were financially possible, I would do so. I do not know if the government would permit our departure, though I suspect they would. I do know that it is not financially possible for me at this time. At no time did I state that the US government would not permit me to leave. |
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:28:15 GMT -5
I stand by that statement. If the US government would permit my family to leave, and if it were financially possible, I would do so. I do not know if the government would permit our departure, though I suspect they would. I do know that it is not financially possible for me at this time. At no time did I state that the US government would not permit me to leave. Very well I misunderstood what you were saying. I'm glad to admit I was wrong. Forgive me. |
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:29:55 GMT -5
I don't think you'd end up being any happier in Switzerland honestly. Especially given some of the restrictions that Michael so well pointed out.
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:32:05 GMT -5
And then you proceeded to claim that US citizens are not permitted to leave the country or some other such drivel that comes from the kinds of sources you get your "Amerikan Police State" info from. Calling my remarks "drivel" is insulting and does not move the conversation forward. If you would like to discuss the facts of the 2007 changes in rules for departure from American travel ports, let's do so in a manner that mutually seeks the find the truth about the issue. Do you have new information about US intelligence departure rules? Has the rule been repealed? If so, then there is new information available and I am anxious to learn the truth and correct my position on the issue. |
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:33:25 GMT -5
I don't think you'd end up being any happier in Switzerland honestly. Especially given some of the restrictions that Michael so well pointed out. I've studied Switzerland considerably and even have an idea of which canton I'd like to live in. You might be surprised at the changes there. Its quite nice. Expensive, though. |
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:36:59 GMT -5
I don't think you'd end up being any happier in Switzerland honestly. Especially given some of the restrictions that Michael so well pointed out. I've studied Switzerland considerably and even have an idea of which canton I'd like to live in. You might be surprised at the changes there. Its quite nice. Expensive, though. Why would they require you to be apart from your family five years? That's not freedom, that's tyranny..... |
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KevinR
Group Commander
2003, 2009 Indy Squadron Champion
Posts: 753
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Post by KevinR on Feb 27, 2010 18:39:31 GMT -5
And then you proceeded to claim that US citizens are not permitted to leave the country or some other such drivel that comes from the kinds of sources you get your "Amerikan Police State" info from. Calling my remarks "drivel" is insulting and does not move the conversation forward. I was referring mainly to the drivel posted in the Amerikan Police State thread moreso than your own remarks. I find those sources to be less than reliable. I do remember years ago asking you for sources for some of the info you were coming up with (still new then), and you wouldn't give them, saying I'd only dismiss them. Yes, when someone posts an opinion-based article as if it is a factual story, and there are absolutely no corroborating sources by which to check, I do consider it drivel. |
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:51:30 GMT -5
I've studied Switzerland considerably and even have an idea of which canton I'd like to live in. You might be surprised at the changes there. Its quite nice. Expensive, though. Why would they require you to be apart from your family five years? That's not freedom, that's tyranny..... Because they want to limit immigration. If you believe that it tyranny, you should go through the process of applying to live in the USA. Its unbelievable. A well educated, professional European friend of mine once spent 6 months trying to get into the USA and after spending considerable money and effort, gave up in disgust. I was unsure if I believe their story or not, so I researched it myself. I found the initial paperwork online and began to fill it out, and then consulted an immigration attorney just to see what people have to go through to get into the USA. He informed me that the USA is by far the most difficult country on earth to get into. Even Muslim dictatorships are much easier to get into. Like my European counterpart, I gave up in disgust after getting to the second level of paperwork. Here's an exercise to try... You are a foreigner. You speak no English. You have $300 in your pocket (a fortune by the standards of most people of the world). You have no internet and no transportation. You have no state papers... no US driver's license, no birth certificate and no passport. You want to enter the "land of the free." Go to the Immigration Information Office of Indianapolis (yes, there is one, at 950 N Meridian) and ask them in the language of your choosing (remember you speak no English - and speaking French or Italian for you is no more difficult than a European immigrant who wants to speak English) and ask how to enter this country legally. You are not lying or doing anything illegal. Just go up and simply ask. I will personally donate $100 toward getting you bailed out of prison if you have any problems. Otherwise, continue the immigration process and see it through. If at any time you run out of money, you can only raise it from someone overseas (remember, you're an immigrant here and have no income). Any takers? When you're done, you'll want to move to Switzerland, too.  |
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 18:54:41 GMT -5
I find those sources to be less than reliable. Please be specific. What, precisely, is incorrect, and according to what information? "I find those sources to be less than reliable. " - KevinAre you not dismissing them now? And you continue to dismiss them despite the fact that the names of the victims, the police officers, the police department, the city and even sometimes the newspapers accounts themselves are listed in the story that you consider "drivel." |
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Michael
Captain
Red Baron Fight XX and XXI Champion
Posts: 407
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Post by Michael on Feb 27, 2010 22:12:41 GMT -5
I don't think you'd end up being any happier in Switzerland honestly. Especially given some of the restrictions that Michael so well pointed out. I'l even post the one I didn't: Clothes may not be hung to dry on Sunday.
You may not wash your car on a Sunday.
A man may not relieve himself while standing up, after 10 P.
Though it is illegal to produce, store, sell and trade absinth (special alcohol), it is legal to consume it.
It is required that every car with snow tires has to have a sticker on its dashboard which tells that the driver should not drive faster than 160 km/h with these tires.
If you forget you car-keys inside the car and you leave the car open, you will be punished.And here's the link again: www.dumblaws.com/laws/switzerlandAnd here's a little tid-bit I found: Indiana Law. www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/indianaAnyone 14 or older who profanely curses, d**ns or swears by the name of God, Jesus Christ or the Holy Ghost, shall be fined one to three dollars for each offense, with a maximum fine of ten dollars per day.  |
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Post by Stephen on Feb 27, 2010 22:30:46 GMT -5
Stripping away the geographic reference to Switzerland, the foundational premise of your statement is that government destroys freedom. They are, as your post demonstrates, diametric opposites, with the existence of one being the death of the other.
Does the truth that you so accurately observed above manifest itself in your political views?
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