joseki
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Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Apr 10, 2007 0:08:02 GMT -5
Not a clue his sheet only had errata not dates. But at 4 issues a year it was probably 10 ???years ago
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joseki
Captain
Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Jun 4, 2007 13:58:23 GMT -5
Hey Guys,
Ok I'm curious. Why is it that none of you play with the medium wound. I've tried a few games with out it and I find that yes the missions become much more survivable but much less interesting.
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albpilot
Ace of Aces
Red Baron Fight XVIII Champ
I'm not frightened of terrorism, so please don't go and create a police state on my account...
Posts: 1,181
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Post by albpilot on Jun 4, 2007 15:40:39 GMT -5
It's another die roll that really doesn't add that much in my opinion.
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Post by Stephen on Jun 4, 2007 15:47:27 GMT -5
Its actually the same die roll, except that the result is divided into one more possible category.
I never really hated the rule, I just didn't know if it added enough to the game to justify the extra distance it placed between our squadron from the rest of the society.
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joseki
Captain
Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Jun 4, 2007 18:59:36 GMT -5
Hmmm...
Is it just more roleplaying than your interested in?
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Post by kirkh on Jun 5, 2007 7:34:05 GMT -5
Not that I've ever used medium wounds, but it seems to me the game is OK right now the way it is. To me it's divided up this way; wounds that don't require the pilot to forego his mission (light wounds) and wounds that require he land his plane as soon as possible (critical wounds). Apart from that, I'm not sure what else would be needed. How do medium wounds impact gameplay?
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joseki
Captain
Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Jun 5, 2007 11:36:12 GMT -5
Hey Kirk,
The medium wound effects game play by making it a serious choice as to whether or not to cut and run from a fight. With a light wound you can stay and fight forever. Its hard to lose consciousness. With a critical wound you land immediatly.
With a medium wound you have a choice to make. There is a 15% chance every turn that the pilot will fall unconscious. It may not seem like much of a chance but it happens more than you would think. So your faced with a choice. Do I stay and try to complete the mission risking death, or do I head for the ground hoping to make it. The better the pilot your flying the more apt you are to break off early.
Dawn Patrol is billed as a role-playing game. IMHO this just makes it a bit more realistic. After all who doesn't want to be a hero by taking a wound, shooting down the guy that gave it to you and returning victorious to the aerodrome where some cute nurse will fix you up. (There is an errata rule that ALL nurses in DP are cute) ;D
To sum up. This rule makes it more likely for your pilot to die, or in the event of him landing there is an increased chance that he will fly a desk the rest of the war.
This rule came out before I started playing back in '98. We've always played with it and I was surprised when Stephen posted asking if anyone played with it. I thought we all did.
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Post by Stephen on Jun 5, 2007 15:45:56 GMT -5
The medium wound effects game play by making it a serious choice as to whether or not to cut and run from a fight. IMHO that is the strongest selling point for the Med Wnd. That's a valid point and I like it when the game expands the possible results of a particular action. The main reason why I never supported the rule at Indy (where its been voted down twice) is because of the extra "distance" it puts between us and the Rest of The Society. I don't know if that's a valid position or not, but it has influenced my thinking on the topic. I don't hate the rule and I'd embrace it if it were more widely used. At the risk of raising the Great Playability Debate here, the Med Wnd rule is a good example of making the game more realistic without affecting playability.
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joseki
Captain
Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Jun 6, 2007 10:24:47 GMT -5
The main reason why I never supported the rule at Indy (where its been voted down twice) is because of the extra "distance" it puts between us and the Rest of The Society. I don't know if that's a valid position or not, but it has influenced my thinking on the topic. I don't hate the rule and I'd embrace it if it were more widely used. At the risk of raising the Great Playability Debate here, the Med Wnd rule is a good example of making the game more realistic without affecting playability. Ok curiosity may have killed the cat, but satisfaction brought him back. On the charts I have (The alternative wound chart) Medium wound is listed. Did Indy just modify that chart and then adopt it?
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Post by Stephen on Jun 6, 2007 17:54:08 GMT -5
No. Just the opposite. Indy's chart predates the creation of the Medium Wound by several years. See the new issue of ISD for details.
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Post by jrmcintyre on Jun 8, 2007 13:12:59 GMT -5
To chime in at the 11th hour on the whole subject. Mark Hudgens brought to me many moons ago the wound location chart that he received from Indy at a tourney--added depth to the game such that you knew where the bullet(s) landed.
An old-time player, Jim Quinn, always wanted some breadth to the wounding--something between the spectrum of -"I'm pilot hit and don't care" and "Gosh, I'm gonna buy the farm." In response, Mark Hudgens & I worked the numbers to expand the "Death Roll" integrating the wound locations. At the time, there was a shift toward percentage dice for all rolls.
After a few iterations of the "Medium Wound Chart", we put it out there as a playtesting piece to see if there were any glaring flaws to prevent it from becoming an "optional" part of Dawn Patrol.
As the years have shown, and, "Thank you for the kind comments, Stephen" there is not a fatal [sic] flaw in the chart. My comments are, "You are welcome to use it if you are so inclined."
As you pointed out, Stephen, Mike Carr never officially endorsed the use of the chart. For some, that is sufficient to dismiss it. Fair enough.
My contention is that the game has evolved over the years and it's up to Mike Carr to determine what is/is not Dawn Patrol (tm). In the latter part of the rules book (7th Ed), the optional rules alter extensively how the game is played.
My impression is that Mike Carr never really cared for the "medium wound" concept. I feel that the concept does not detract from the game but adds depth without sacrificing playability.
I'll continue to keep the medium wound amongst my charts. Don't judge me too harshly, I'm not cheating, just adding to my enjoyment of the game.
Respectively yours, Jim McIntyre
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joseki
Captain
Come to the dark side!
Posts: 274
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Post by joseki on Jun 9, 2007 0:26:23 GMT -5
Well I appreaciate it Jim. Thanks
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Post by Stephen on Jun 9, 2007 21:28:31 GMT -5
Don't judge me too harshly, I'm not cheating, just adding to my enjoyment of the game. Goodness no... its not cheating and I hope the article doesn't come across as a judgement. But the MW rule really is among the most controversial rules of recent years (regardless of which side one takes) and few groups now use it as a standard. Please accept my apologies if those observations came across as denigrating. I just find it humorous that so many players are so emotional about it. I have seen people get mad and literally stomp away from a game where the MW was used... I am not one of them. Never have been. But I do find it funny and wanted to do a piece on the little-known Indy Squadron connection. BTW, the article was not written in response to this thread. It was written last winter after Dory found the old photo shown in the article and turned it in for publication in ISD. I've just been holding it until we had an issue with available space.
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